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cm72
About 10 weeks in and here is where we are at...
My D is about 2000-2250 calories as of now. She is still very restrictive. We had a little period of time where I could get her to try new things but she has gotten restrictive again. Anytime I try to introduce anything new at this point is backfiring even with all the positive, calming self talk. So I have decided to back way off and just worry about increasing her calories right now with the foods she will eat. I bought some Benecalorie and we are trying it this morning in some grape juice. Doesn't mix the best but the taste is masked. I'm going to tell her it's stool softener since she's very concerned about the bloating, etc.
For those who know about her eating cereal in a smaller bowl the past 2 weeks, we "broke" the bowl two days ago and that resulted in three hours of freakout yesterday morning. I tried the "life stops until you eat" and wouldn't take her to school until she had cereal from another bowl. I ended up getting two bites in her and now she just won't eat cereal. She said she was going to have toast this morning which I know is less calories so i'm hoping the Benecalorie will make up for that loss. 
She is a very strong willed child and I just can't seem to force any issue right now (bigger portions, new foods, eating with us at the table). Even if I work through it every day for hours. It was tearing me apart and i've started having lockjaw, depression, etc. I decided I just can't do it and i'll just keep with the foods she will eat but try to increase portions. I know i've read of someone waiting six months before trying fear foods. Anyone else? I'm just so nervous that waiting will make things worst but her anxiety is at an all time high and i'm not getting anywhere.
Typical day of food:
Breakfast: Used to be cereal with milk. We will see what becomes of the toast with jam today.
Snack 1: Nuts
Lunch: Ham and cheese Sandwich with chips or pita hummus carrots and cheese or apples, pretzels and cubed cheese.
Snack 2: Belvita cracker/cookie
Dinner: See Lunch but also juice
Snack 3: Same as breakfast
She also will have yogurt pouches or applesauce.
Luckily, the bouncing when she walked has mainly stopped. Not happening as much. We are going to go get weighed every two weeks with the doctor as there is no way I want to weigh her at home. I'll find out today what she's at. Last weigh in she was at 96. I really hope we are at 98. The dietitian wants her at 105-110.
Living with her is like being on a roller coaster. Happy and loving the one minute, the next she's screaming her head off and throwing things. Hopefully the next update is more positive.
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Torie
cm72 wrote:
For those who know about her eating cereal in a smaller bowl the past 2 weeks, we "broke" the bowl two days ago and that resulted in three hours of freakout yesterday morning. I tried the "life stops until you eat" and wouldn't take her to school until she had cereal from another bowl. I ended up getting two bites in her and now she just won't eat cereal. She said she was going to have toast this morning which I know is less calories so i'm hoping the Benecalorie will make up for that loss. 


Oh dang, this tightrope performance is so stressful.  Ugh.  Good for you to break the bowl - I think it's important to keep fighting for that cereal although I do realize that not every battle can be won.

Have you tried spoonfeeding her (literally) like when she was a toddler?  I was really surprised that that helped my d during the really hard times.

Does it make sense to try waking her up at least and hour early in the morning with bowl in hand, "Here, eat this and you can roll over and go back to sleep"?  It seems as though ED can be a bit slow to wake up in the morning so some have had good luck with that.

Does she eat better with a "witness"?  If so, can a friend or relative join you for breakfast?

What do you think would happen if you served cereal at a different meal, say, dinner?

If the cereal is absolutely a no-go, I wonder if you could replace it with a smoothie.  Or a high calorie muffin.  

Do I remember correctly that she wants to go to school?  If yes, I urge you to stick to your guns and require full nutrition before she heads off - "As soon as you have finished your breakfast, you can go to school."

Do you have good professional backup?  Could you take your d along with her cereal to them?

Just trying to help brainstorm a bit as I think breakfast is a really important start to the day.  

Please keep us posted. xx

-Torie
"We are angels of hope, of healing, and of light. Darkness flees from us." -YP 
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cm72
She just called me here at work (her dad is at home with her in the morning) and she was screaming crying because her dad made her the toast. She wanted to make it herself. Then she said she didn't want to go to school which is what she always says when she's anxious. She says school is overwhelming. I talked to her for about 20 minutes and got her calmed down and happy again. I seem to do better on the phone, not sure why. Anyways my H just texted me and said she is eating cereal but asked to wait for the drink until tonight. So yay for small victories about eating the cereal but now i'm reading my H text that it was an even smaller bowl than the one we just broke. Dangit!
Torie-I love all the advice you gave. I haven't tried spoonfeeding her again but i'm willing to try anything. 
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ValentinaGermania
Maybe you need to break all small bowls...[wink]
In my experience it worked well to serve the same portion in a bigger bowl because it looks smaller then...
Cereal with milk is better to add cream or benecalorie because it will seperate in the grape juice. Would she eat porridge for breakfast? Benecalorie is better with warm food.

Dad makes the toast or she eats cereals. That is a new rule and you get what you want...[wink]
Keep feeding. There is light at the end of the tunnel.
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cm72
She can instantly taste cream in the cereal. I tried that. [frown]
I like the idea of taking the small bowl amount and adding to the bigger bowl then slowly adding the amount. Great idea.
Unfortunately she won't eat any warm foods. 
I'm allowing her to make her own breakfast but her dad has to verify the amount. That's the only meal/snack she is allowed a say on since breakfast is such a hard time normally. I want her to feel like she has a little control.
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Enn
Hmmm cm72,
What is the cereal she is eating? Could it be switched to a high calorie one? I see you found the super resisters thread helpful and I am glad. There are so many ways to get the calories in.
Keep positive, keep feeding!!
XXX
When within yourself you find the road, the right road will open.  (Dejan Stojanovic)

Food+more food+time+love+good professional help+ATDT+no exercise+ state not just weight+/- the "right" medicine= healing---> recovery(--->life without ED)
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ValentinaGermania
Try to add a teaspoon of cream (or even less) and increase the portion very slowly.
The big bowl thing is working very well here. I use deep plates for a lot of meals, too, because the portion looks smaller then.

"Unfortunately she won't eat any warm foods."
That is the first thing I would try to work on. Try it with a soup. Just one teaspoon. Then two. Then half a cup. It would be so much easier with warm foods.
Keep feeding. There is light at the end of the tunnel.
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Foodsupport_AUS
It is so hard isn't CM72. Really you are doing very well. If you are in the last 10 lbs that could be one reason why things seem to be getting harder. 

My D was one who would just stop eating if I pushed to hard, so I understand the hesitation, yet at the same time your D is really young - 10 I think. It would seem to be much more appropriate that at this age you do really push the insisting that you prepare the food, choose the bowl etc.. 

Has she stopped throwing the food? A good reason to get a new set of plastic bowls etc. that she will be using for the foreseeable future. 

I also didn't make D go to school if she was too anxious. I had one priority when she was acutely ill and that was to get enough food in every meal. That made her extremely anxious. If she felt too anxious to go to school I let her avoid that anxiety. I knew that when she felt more herself that she would want to go, and she did. 
D diagnosed restrictive AN June 2010 age 13.5. Weight restored July 2012. Relapse and now clawing our way back. Treatment: multiple hospitalisations and individual and family therapy.
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Hibiscus
Hi cm72
I am refeeding/ refed my d on limited and accepted ( by her) food with weight gain. as she has gained I have worked with her to identify fear food and we r working our way through this. So there is time for this if it is too hard for your d now. That’s ok. You need to trust your instincts And now sort through this. I may be wrong but She needs ( or ed ) needs to control food right now and for your daughters anxiety I would try to work with that on your terms. I assume you have been given guidelines around diet or are following guidelines ? An idea may be to offer 2 choices of breakfast being for example 1. 1.5 cups cereal plus milk plus cup of juice and fruit or 2. toast with cheese plus milk plus fruit? But what is offered needs to fit with what you think she needs, if you get my drift? She doesn’t need to know the amounts. At this point it doesn’t matter what bowl it goes in just that she eats enough and bowls can be dealt with later. If she is only 10 years old, sorry but she doesn’t get to prepare her breakfast, that sounds like ed to me.
School anxiety is hard for them and us. I try to encourage my d to go but some days it is just too much. They will catch up. Don’t know if any of this is helpful, take what works for you
🌺xx
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cm72
Well yesterday was a bad day. She only had 1000 calories and her anxiety was high. She challenged me on every meal. I feel like ED realizes that i'm relaxing a bit and is starting to take over. She could taste the benecalorie and everytime i've tried to use higher calorie items or sneak in extra foods, she's freaked out. She is also noticing that some kids during lunch are not eating. Yesterday she didn't eat. I suggested to her that I pull her during lunch and she eats in my car but that freaked her out. I then suggested the nurses office or counselor but that didn't help either. I've always grappled with how you all make your kids eat 3000 plus calories. My kid just fights me and refuses. I'm thinking about scheduling a skype with Eva and having her "sit" with us during a feeding. I also just checked out the San Diego program. It's only a six hour drive for us so it's nice to have that in our back pocket if needed.


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cm72
scaredmom wrote:
Hmmm cm72,
What is the cereal she is eating? Could it be switched to a high calorie one? I see you found the super resisters thread helpful and I am glad. There are so many ways to get the calories in.
Keep positive, keep feeding!!
XXX


She's eating Chex right now. Not sure what that is called world wide. I have a huge variety of cereals in my pantry. I also got some 2% milk and put a little in the 1% and figured i'd build up. But of course, at last night's 3rd snack she did not have any milk. Go figure. It's like she senses something's up.

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cm72
Foodsupport_AUS wrote:
It is so hard isn't CM72. 

Has she stopped throwing the food? A good reason to get a new set of plastic bowls etc. that she will be using for the foreseeable future. 

I also didn't make D go to school if she was too anxious. I had one priority when she was acutely ill and that was to get enough food in every meal. That made her extremely anxious. If she felt too anxious to go to school I let her avoid that anxiety. I knew that when she felt more herself that she would want to go, and she did. 


She is still throwing food like crazy. We use nothing but plastic plates and bowls for her.
She is begging me to keep her at home and home school but i'm working more on having her do relaxation techniques and distraction for anxiety. PLus everytime I pick her up, she's always smiling and laughing with her friends. My other daughter went through a stage at this age where she wanted me to homeschool her too so i'm not sure if it's the anxiety from ED or if it's just normal age behavior.
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Torie
cm72 wrote:
 I want her to feel like she has a little control.


Sorry to say this, but your d does not have any control right now.  ED is the one who has almost all the control, and wresting this control from ED will very likely be the hardest thing you will ever do.  If your d had control, she would be able to eat warm foods.  

It may appear to your d that you are taking control away from her.  Many sufferers do complain about that.  But, again, if she DID have control, she would be able to eat warm food.   Right now, ED is too strong for your d to regain control over her eating - she needs you to take over this control for her.   Once you are in control, you can s-l-o-o-o-o-o-w-l-y give the control back to her.

The only way your d can have control is if you give it to her.  In order to give it to her, you actually have the control yourself.  So I encourage you to avoid the trap of worrying about whether your d does or does not have control.  If she complains about it, you could briefly acknowledge and then change the subject: "It sounds like you are really frustrated about that.  Do you know where I put my keys?" type of thing.

I agree with Tina that warm foods are really important.  I like her suggestion of starting with one spoonful and working your way up from there.  Do you think that is worth a try?

I really feel for you.  This is such a tough and terrible journey. xx

-Torie
"We are angels of hope, of healing, and of light. Darkness flees from us." -YP 
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ValentinaGermania
"PLus everytime I pick her up, she's always smiling and laughing with her friends."
Same here. She was anxious in the morning and did not want to go and when I fetched her up and asked how school was she would have just said "fine".

"She could taste the benecalorie and everytime i've tried to use higher calorie items or sneak in extra foods, she's freaked out."
You need to try it again and again. First time they freak out. Next time it gets slightly better and third time she ate it without complain. Do not let ED win that game!

"I suggested to her that I pull her during lunch and she eats in my car but that freaked her out. I then suggested the nurses office or counselor but that didn't help either."
If she doesn´t eat her lunch that must have consequences. So if she freaks out you have done something right: you have told her what the consequence is and ED freaked out because of it. So you now need to DO it. If she does not eat lunch the next time you will take her to your car the next day. I promise you will only need to do that once or twice [wink].

What consequences does it have at the moment when she refuses to eat what you serve? Can you explain how a typical meal would be so we can help you with ideas what to try next?

Calling Eva or doing UCSD is surely a great idea. But at the age of your d I would keep that in back and first try to do it at home (because you will need to do that afterwards anyway). She is so young. I am sure you can show ED who is the boss. I had to do it with my nearly adult d. It is not easy but really all you need to do is to be strict and stay firm and go through it. No negotiation, no discussions, this is the way we do it now.

Tina72
Keep feeding. There is light at the end of the tunnel.
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Torie
cm72 wrote:
I'm thinking about scheduling a skype with Eva and having her "sit" with us during a feeding. I also just checked out the San Diego program. It's only a six hour drive for us so it's nice to have that in our back pocket if needed.


I would urge you to call them both.  Today.   So many people have said that the UCSD program kick started recovery and that they wished they had gone sooner.  I think you're at the perfect  time to call them.  Lucky you to be so close.  xx

-Torie
"We are angels of hope, of healing, and of light. Darkness flees from us." -YP 
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ValentinaGermania
"It may appear to your d that you are taking control away from her.  Many sufferers do complain about that.  But, again, if she DID have control, she would be able to eat warm food."

Like Torie said, many parents have problems to dare to take over, but in fact you are not taking control from your d but only from ED.

The problem is that we are the kids of the 68. We raised our kids in a democratic way and discussed everything with them the moment they could say "yes" and "no". And now we should go back to the old times with senteces like "you will eat what is on the table"? YES. BECAUSE IT WILL SAVE THEIR LIVES.

You are not strict with your d. You are strict with ED. And the moment ED sees that you have more power than he has your d will see that she does not need to follow EDs rules any more. My d was suffering so much from ED. She was so hungry but ED did not allow her to eat. In the end ED stopped her even from drinking water because the voice said "your tummy gets fat from that glas of water". What tummy? There was only bones left...

Fight that bastard out of your d´s life. You can do that. You just need to dare it.

Tina72
Keep feeding. There is light at the end of the tunnel.
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debra18
How to I get in 3000 calories? In the morning she drinks a milkshake with her sandwich. It's has 1 cup of heavy cream, 1 cup of ice cream, several spoons of chopped nuts and two small chocolate bars. It's more than 1000 calories. With her supper I make a fruit smoothie and also add several spoons of chopped nuts. You can start with a cup of milk with two meals and slowly work up to this kind of drink. Often my daughter write me notes that she doesn't need milkshakes anymore and everyone eats less than her. I write back that she has a very high metabolism and this is what she needs for her health.
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cm72
I think she's had a setback and I was overwhelmed with that week my husband was gone so I backed off. We definitely need a kick in the pants to get refocused. I'm going to look into the skype with Eva and have my H attend.
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debra18
Also if she is going to school she will have to be supervised either by you or a staff member there is no way around it. Yes she won't like it. But I think it's a motivation for my dauther not to go backwards. She had to miss classand go to a separate room . She did not like it but knew she needed it. She doesn't want that to happen again.
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Enn
cm72,
It is hard to get the control away from ED. We all had to do it. Once D knows that you are in control it does get easier. And I think the child needs that reassurance that you will be in control. It takes a paradigm shift in thinking and how we parent to do that. No choice about food at all. Ie the calories are your decision alone,but the foods as mentioned above, can have a bit of choice. (Pancakes or waffles?)

I really would add some cream to the milk and if you put a small amount in she may not notice and even if she does say it tastes different, you could just say "Oh, OK, that's odd, tastes good to me". She or ED may be testing you, saying that it tastes different, but it really doesn't. My D would say "did you do something to this?" I would say, "I don't know what that would mean? It is your meal." My D was always suspicious, "did you do something, what did you add, I am suspicious of what you are doing with the food etc.." It takes a while to get your armour on. I tried to avoid the fights, and would back down a bit in the first few weeks. You have to push through, you will likely have to fight it out to show ED who is in charge. But hard and scary, I know.
Reaching out to USCD, Eva etc. is a great plan.

I wonder, once you feel more confident to challenge, manage ED, then you will be able to tackle the extra calories. 
XXX
When within yourself you find the road, the right road will open.  (Dejan Stojanovic)

Food+more food+time+love+good professional help+ATDT+no exercise+ state not just weight+/- the "right" medicine= healing---> recovery(--->life without ED)
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cm72
scaredmom wrote:

I wonder, once you feel more confident to challenge, manage ED, then you will be able to tackle the extra calories. 


EXACTLY! I think I lost my confidence last week. I need to get it back. 
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Enn
know you will get it back!!
XXX
When within yourself you find the road, the right road will open.  (Dejan Stojanovic)

Food+more food+time+love+good professional help+ATDT+no exercise+ state not just weight+/- the "right" medicine= healing---> recovery(--->life without ED)
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Mcmum
Hi CM72,
It sounds like you're in the thick of it but I too think that with you and your h working side by side you can wrestle control back from ed. Our s is not much younger than your d and we have had to give him no choice or control over what he eats as ed was increasingly whittling away at him until he wasn't satisfied with any amount of food at all.
Can you keep your d out of the kitchen completely? Tell her that you are looking after her now and giving her what she needs as she is very poorly? She is so young and so ruled by ed thoughts. It is horribly difficult at first when your child would rather lose a limb than eat a meal but you will get there. Eva Musby's videos helped us enormously so we were able to keep up a calm mantra during meal times even when inside our hearts were breaking. That food has got to go in!
Wishing you iron strength and courage. You can do this x
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Nicstar4
Oh cm72 you are doing an amazing job!
There are some weeks where you don’t get all the cals in. I Have started buying extra cream milk and that is the only one available in the house.
I love that you no longer have the bowl. May be an idea to move all the small bowls.
I have been told that cereal is particularly hard because it is so uneven And changes when the milk goes in. We use pre portion packets (although they are too small in my opinion)which limits arguing options.
You have got this, keep going x
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KLB
My s won't eat anything except the carrots on your list.....you're doing an amazing job getting those foods into her. It might not feel like it but you are making tiny, almost invisible steps of progress everyday and one day when you look back you'll suddenly see just how far you've come. I can't wait for that day.
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