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clem

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I threw out our home scales this morning. it is ruling D15 every day for 8 months. I did hide it for a couple weeks for the first time recently, but she found it, used it this morning and went mental. So I broke them this morning, put my foot down and said no more scales

I said I did it because they are ruling her. I said I did it because I love her. She has made a big leap and went from 1000 calories a day to 1200, of course this made her weight go from 45kg to this morning 46.5. You can imagine the response of the anorexic voice. She became aggressive and attacked me, threw and broke precious things in her room. This was BEFORE I got rid of the scales.

She cut herself and started screaming and shouting, so I said no more scales and got rid of them.

Now she has threatened not to eat anything and is sobbing upstairs, I think I made it worse, I think I made a major mistake, taking those scales away, what if she doesn't eat? but she is so violent towards me, the dogs are properly scared. I don't know what to do.

I am supposed to go to work today, there is no way I can leave her at home with my 80 year old Mum. I only go to work 2 times a week, I am so scared that I'll loose my job, but I really cannot go in.

FBT has been extremely hard, we have so far in 3 weeks from 1000 cal, gone to 1200 cal (yes, I know this is not enough). D made that choice to eat more, which is great to see, although small in your eyes, it was a hug thing in this house. But the damn scales have been a real nightmare.

I am so sorry for the rant, but I don't know what to do. I am scared for her. I know that I took away a 'comfort' thing for her anorexia and boy does she hate me. Hitting, scratching. spitting in my face, thumping, throwing objects... it's too much.

Right now, for all sorts of reasons, I feel like a total failure of a mother.

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D15, AN. 5' 8" and 46kg. Diagnosed and hospitalised in Sept 2017 for 9 days. At home since in recovery/relapse. In the trenches and tackling FBT.
clem

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Reply with quote  #2 
Have spoken to the GP, now that they are open and they suggest more intervention with CAMHS (who are pants btw). They will get back to me in a bit.

I am sorry to rant like a child, but this is just so hard, I feel quite overwhelmed. FBT over the last couple weeks has been exhausting and very slow going...... I know why D is scared, angry and lashing out. I am challenging AN (I think that I did it in a rather abrupt way, by breaking the scales), the daily distress AN causes her, is not right at all. I think she needs medication. She has always been an anxious child, it is in  her to worry and freak out if things don't go a certain way.

Cannot imagine she will be sent to a unit, she is not medically unstable enough, same goes for the hospital.

She is actually eating breakfast now, which is very reassuring and at least something......

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D15, AN. 5' 8" and 46kg. Diagnosed and hospitalised in Sept 2017 for 9 days. At home since in recovery/relapse. In the trenches and tackling FBT.
Mamaroo

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Reply with quote  #3 
Hi Clem, sorry it is so hard now, but you did the right thing! We also got rid of the scales. I caught my daughter in our bathroom weighing herself at the beginning of treatment and that was it. We took the batteries out and hid it (luckily she hasn't found it yet). Off course it will increase your d's anxiety levels, yes, she will say she won't eat anymore, but as you saw now, she is eating breakfast. That is a big win for you!

And rant away, we understand and are here you.

Sending you plenty of virtual hugs!!!!!


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D became obsessed with exercise at age 9. Started eating 'healthy' at age 9.5. Restricting couple of months later. IP for 2 weeks at age 10. Slowly refed for a year and WR at age 11 in March 2017. She is back to her old happy self and can eat anything put in front of her. Now working on intuitive eating.
clem

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Reply with quote  #4 
She ate! It is a win, she however is flat out refusing to eat further if I don't order more scales online now. The screaming and begging is awful. She has asked to be weighed once a week at home... I wont get more scales..... I wont. I'll just see if she eats in the meantime. What a nightmare situation. I have never heard such hateful words from my lovely child.  I can separate AN from D, but it's a fine line!

Thanks for the hugs, need them so much. I feel so low and very deflated



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D15, AN. 5' 8" and 46kg. Diagnosed and hospitalised in Sept 2017 for 9 days. At home since in recovery/relapse. In the trenches and tackling FBT.
tina72

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Reply with quote  #5 
Hi clem,
you did the very right thing and it is obvious you annoyed ED with that because you see him screeming so much today.
That is a victory! If you see ED, you did the right thing!
She needs to be weighed once a week but not at home. Ask your GP to do that and start to do blind weighing. She should not know her weight, that will make her go through the roof first but then it will be a big release for her.
Please, do never apologize for venting, that is the right place to do that.
And please forget all the awful words she said. It was ED who said those words because clem:1 ED:0 this morning!
Keep fighting! It will get worse before it gets better but you need to increase the intake to get more weight on her soon.
She will fight you for 1200 calories the same as for 1500 and for 2000 calories, so make the fight worth it! Eating is torture for her at the moment and if you increase the calories too slow you just extend the torture.
The sooner she gaines the lost weight, the sooner her brain starts recovery and she will be the nice lovely girl again you knew before.
She is in there. Help her to come out.
Please be careful and take away everything with that she can hurt herself and you. Put away precious things [wink]
AND DO NOT BUY A NEW SCALE. NEVER.
Please feel hugged by me, too. I know it is so hard but you can do that. The price you win is worth it, believe me.
Yes, it is all too much. Try to calm down a bit and reload your batteries. It is a marathon, not a sprint. You need power for the long run. But there is light at the end of that tunnel. Go through it. Keep swimming.
Tina72
Kali

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Reply with quote  #6 
Hi Clem,

It is not a mistake to throw out the scales. We had no scales also. Blind weighing and only done in the nutritionist/dr. office for quite some time.

There is an old saying on ATDT:
"When you are getting flak you are over the target."

Someone in the facebook group was posting videos of recovered eating disorder sufferers smashing scales awhile back. You are not alone.

Keep increasing her calories. You don't have to let her know you are doing that.

warmly,

Kali


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berry75

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Reply with quote  #7 
Hello sorry things are so hard for you right now,my advice is to do what works best for you.My d was really stuck at one point with a particular weight that she was determined to stay under.I felt the regular weigh ins were holding us back.We had never owned a set of scales and I didnt have any at home when my daughter first got sick.We were following maudsley at home,having monthly visits to the childrens hospital and weekly visits to phycologist.After some persuasion our phycologist agree to blind weigh my daughter.Weight loses and gains were discussed but a number never mentioned.As she has gotten better the number seems less important.Its a long road and we are by no means finished our journey but one thing I have learnt is that the Maudsley method doesn't have to be a one size fits all treatment.It helped us more than I can say but trusting my instincts as a mum did as well.
Foodsupport_AUS

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Reply with quote  #8 
It is so hard, but you did exactly the right thing. Please don't give in to your D's fears. Acknowledge that she finds is finding it scary but also let her know that you are confident that it is the right thing. Your D is 2 in much of her behaviour at the moment. If your 2 year old was playing with knives you would not give in to that tantrum. You would acknowledge her distress and comfort her. It will pass, and she will get to a point that she will not want to be weighed at all. There is a good reason why many of us have blind weighed and some stopped weighing at all. Keep going and push that intake up further and faster. 
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D diagnosed restrictive AN June 2010 age 13.5. Weight restored July 2012. Relapse and now clawing our way back. Treatment: multiple hospitalisations and individual and family therapy.
clem

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Reply with quote  #9 
Thank you so much FEAST family.

My heart breaks, she is so tired and exhausted, just from sobbing all day long! I want to comfort her, but at the moment she will either lash out or shout, so I stay away, until she needs me. She has a very distorted body image, self checking has started again,.... I know it's the ugly putrid head of AN, it just feels like a bloody 10 headed Hydra at the moment.

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D15, AN. 5' 8" and 46kg. Diagnosed and hospitalised in Sept 2017 for 9 days. At home since in recovery/relapse. In the trenches and tackling FBT.
Torie

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Reply with quote  #10 
Hi Clem - So sorry for the difficulty.  I just want to say that tomorrow is a new day, and just because today is a terrible, horrible one, that doesn't tell you what tomorrow will bring.  Tomorrow may be fine.  (Or not.)   Good days often follow the bad.

Hang in there.  It does get better.  xx

-Torie

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"We are angels of hope, of healing, and of light. Darkness flees from us." -YP 
mid73

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Reply with quote  #11 
Hi Clem
Sorry you are having an awful time. Chucking the scales was the absolutely right thing to do. I’ve often found that ED can sometimes go ballistic but if you don’t engage, it can sometimes subside and despite threats, eating does continue. My d was terribly violent in the early days and we just couldn’t get past it. So she was hospitalised despite being medically stable. I’m in the UK, I’m really sorry CAMHS is not helping you more. Are they aware of the violence towards you?

Here’s to a better day tomorrow. X
clem

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Reply with quote  #12 
Thanks,

Mid73, I have been on the phone to GP this morning and then CAMHS, I was just told what protocol to follow with CAMHS. Call the police if this, call the GP if that, go to the hospital if that.... not really helpful. D's new team leave a bit to be desired, her key worker only works Mon to Wed. Although I have been calling all week due to the daily crisis at home, which has only escalated. D has been shouting at me all day and evening, it's relentless, she must be exhausted and so full of hate right now. It's because there are no scales tomorrow, so the distorted body image has come back with a vengeance.

I have asked CAMHS to reassess D on Monday, she will either have calmed a bit then, or will need to go to hospital, or get on some medication. I am concerned about her tipping over the edge and hurting herself. It's hard when you see new behavior like this and have no idea how to anticipate. D also has a GP appointment Monday 6pm, hopefully between CAMHS and GP, they will be able to figures where is best for D right now.

Here's hoping tomorrow will be a bit better.

xxx

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D15, AN. 5' 8" and 46kg. Diagnosed and hospitalised in Sept 2017 for 9 days. At home since in recovery/relapse. In the trenches and tackling FBT.
scaredmom

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Reply with quote  #13 
So sorry you have had a such a hard day. You did the best thing with getting rid of scales. I know it is so hard.
We did find after a terrible day, D was calmer the next day or even after a few hours. I hope tomorrow is better. Please try to get some rest.

XXX
needhelp

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Reply with quote  #14 
Hi Clem - your daughter is fortunate to have you helping her fight ED. You did the right thing with the scales- I think we’ve all had some sort of “rip the band aid off” moment- rough at first- but ends up better. I do agree with you about trusting your Mama instincts- you know her best. We are all here for you- 🤗
tina72

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Reply with quote  #15 
Hi clem,

"I am concerned about her tipping over the edge and hurting herself."

I think she does not know where to leave all the anger and hatred and so she blames herself by selfharm.
We had good progress with that after giving her a punching bag. So she could hit something without hurting herself and get rid of all that anger. Worth a try?
I must say I used it very often when she was in school...[wink]

Tina72
clem

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I had an early night sleep! It was much needed.

A punching bag is a very good idea Tina72. I will look into this. We have a small conservatory that gets no use.......

I get concerned when when she starts the 'I am so fat', I am gaining weight, 'I don't look anorexic anymore'...... chatter. It's in this mood that D is most upset and volatile and gains momentum in anger. 

She woke up this morning (we would have weighed her by now) and is not talking to me (which is absolutely fine, as long as it keeps her calm and the poor dogs aren't shaking like leaves), AND she is preparing a pre breakfast snack (which I allow her to do). I took over the main meals cooking a couple weeks back. She has also set out what she wants me to cook (porridge) This is great news, I am relieved that she sees the sense to eat... I do still get the chatter about buying more scales or else.....

needhelp, thank you so much, it was lovely to hear that.

One thing I have not mentioned so far, to add to it all, is my partner and myself of 9 years is moving out in a weekish (not Ds Dad), he refuses to leave until I can 'buy him out' of the property. I did everything to keep this house, D does not need an upheaval like moving house right now, I managed it by getting a remortgage, which is scary, but I can just about manage it, just need to hang on to my job (also love this house)! My ex partner is not a family person. I tried everything over the years, but to no avail, he really does not like D, is extremely un supportive and very lazy person, it just got way too much in the end (I think for 2 straight years it was crapy - which includes the time D . This has taken it's toll on me most, but it has of course affected D, she feels very uneasy when he is around. I make him stay away at weekends. It's nearly over, so that will be a huge relief.

I also have Anemia, a bulging disk in lower back and some awful new hip pain (not been looked at yet). On the bad days, I find it real hard to cope with D, but I just keep thinking we will get through this and the medicine I have in the evening is great! lol.

I recently bought a copy of 'Survive FBT' a skills manual for parents/carers for Child and Adolescent Anorexia, by Maria Ganci. It's really very helpful, a small book that does not take a lot of time to read through. Someone mentioned it on here in a post, whoever you are, THANKYOU.

HUGS BACK TO YOU ALL.

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D15, AN. 5' 8" and 46kg. Diagnosed and hospitalised in Sept 2017 for 9 days. At home since in recovery/relapse. In the trenches and tackling FBT.
tina72

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Reply with quote  #17 
Hi clem,
if you could put the punching bag into an extra room that would be great so you can control she is not using it for over-exercising (mine did not).
Porridge is great, you can hide canola oil, creme, butter or benecalorie in it (or all together).
Try to calm down a bit when your partner has moved out and do something for yourself.
And please contact a doc to control that new hip pain, the last thing you want to have is you need to go to hospital for surgery or so.
You are the most important person in your house at the moment so please take care of yourself.
You are needed.
Tina72
yellowcaty

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Reply with quote  #18 
Hi Clem

I’ve have been reading your posts for the last couple of days and have been thinking about you and sending virtual support. Things have been horrendous in my house for a while, but I can’t begin to imagine how you not only cope with ED, but also with ending a relationship and your own health. You are a true inspiration and need to be applauded for the great Mum you are.

If you are at the point where you think an IP bed is needed push CAMHS or write to the Commissioners if they won’t help. We were really lucky with our CAMHS team and it makes me so mad and sad that not everyone gets the same care and support that they deserve.

Sending you lots of love, support and hope for a better day.
Stay strong
Yellowcaty
clem

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Reply with quote  #19 
Yellowcaty, your meaningful post made me cry, in a lot of posts here made me cry. I do not know what i would do without you all. I think we are all super hero's. I read so many challenging situations... and so much inner strength.

I fear and agree with you Yellowcaty, D might need to be given a IP bed for her safety. She is eating today, which is good and I just hope this continues, it's very hard to get more than 1200 calories in her at the moment, but I will keep at it. The anxiety and distress remain extremely high.

I caught her exercising earlier, doing sneaky leg lifts. I just cant be with her 24/7.
I also noticed new self harm marks on her arm. I removed all sharps from her room and around the house, need to search further (she might have done this yesterday am, just after I removed the scales and the sharps).

D has impossible XS leggings, refuses to wear anything else. The are blooming tiny to begin with, but are now becoming uncomfortable due to a bit of weight gain, this just fuels the fire. I have ordered 2 pairs of the same in the next size up and plan to replace them, tags out. I know she will figure it out though.... I just can't convince her to wear loose bottom half clothes.

If I got a punching bag, conservatory would be best, I can at least lock the door and monitor usage, just in case.

I do need to look after myself more, I do skimp on that bit..... seeing GP on Monday about my Hip and will corner CAMHS/GP on Monday re D and safety/coping at home v IP bed. It would crush her to have to go, but it's clearly not going too well at home.

When partner goes, I have a bottle of Champagne hiding. That will be a massive relief, a bit of an upheaval when he moves some furniture out... but that's the least of my worries.

Thank you for all your continued support and brilliant suggestions.
xxxxxxxx


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D15, AN. 5' 8" and 46kg. Diagnosed and hospitalised in Sept 2017 for 9 days. At home since in recovery/relapse. In the trenches and tackling FBT.
Torie

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Reply with quote  #20 
Quote:
Originally Posted by clem
I do need to look after myself more, I do skimp on that bit..... seeing GP on Monday about my Hip and will corner CAMHS/GP on Monday re D and safety/coping at home v IP bed. It would crush her to have to go, but it's clearly not going too well at home.


In your shoes, I think I would push for IP.  It really sounds like one person (read: superhero) is not enough to keep your d safe and drag her back to health.  In some countries, carer fatigue is a factor in deciding if IP will be offered so please be sure to let them know about your own health issues, financial issues with needing to work, and the toll it is taking on you.  WHen talking to them is not the time for stoicism!  Let it all tumble out.

With you in spirit. xx

-Torie

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"We are angels of hope, of healing, and of light. Darkness flees from us." -YP 
tina72

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Reply with quote  #21 
I think Torie is right, you need to care for yourself and you need to work and you cannot be with her 24/7. So maybe it would be a good start to have her IP for some time to regain the first pounds/kg and then do the rest at home. Please ask CAMHS for that on Monday because they will have waiting lists. You could put her on it and then decide what to do when you have a bed offered, but that could be a good plan B for both of you. I cannot even imagine to have done that alone as a single parent. You do not help her if you break down, too. Many here got a good start from IP.

Self harm: If she harmed herself AFTER you took away all sharps, you might have overseen something which could be used and you did not expect it to be used. My d harmed herself with a paperclip in IP. So maybe that is what she used, too. Does she have any needles from handwork in her room? A manicure set? A circle from school/maths?

Please keep us updated what you decided to do on Monday. And keep fighting, it will get better again.
Tina72



scaredmom

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Reply with quote  #22 
Hi clem,
I am glad you got some rest last night. It really sounds like your plate is overflowing. IP may be a good thing to get the ball rolling, give you some time and space to take care of yourself and get time to get ready when she comes home. I know that sounds so easy and it isn't. To do this alone is incredible and I send you strength and support. Only we who have been through it can appreciate the toll it takes. Please go to the doc for your issues to keep healthy and strong.
I hope today is better
XXX
tina72

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Reply with quote  #23 
Hi clem,
how are you doing? I was thinking about you...
Tina72
Doitagain

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Reply with quote  #24 
Hi - I haven't read all your posts but.. with you on throwing out the scales. It is ONE thing you can do that you never ever have to give in on. If she buys another - throw that one out too. I threw ours on a skip one day - and all hell ensued. There has never been a scales in our house, or even hotel rooms since (I used to ring ahead). It didn't solve anything but was one less thing. Four years down the line my D IS healthy! Living a full life. They are all small steps but steps in the right direction. You did TOTALLY the right thing. There will be other issues going forward. this won't be one of them and you can tick your victories against ED off one at a time.x
X
clem

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Reply with quote  #25 
Thank you doitagain. and thanks for checking in Tina72. still in the trenches here and very dark places that I didn't know existed.

It's been a surreal week so far and I have a few updates, non that I am sure of tbh.

1. CAMHS called me on Monday morning and advised ( by new consultant who has not actually seen D, has only had one session with me) that D does not need to go on medication and in regard to IP, that was a no as well. They wanted to move forward in another way and suggested that I meet with the EDS team on a regular basis (since D refuses to engage with them herself) and try it that way, I assume they are talking about continuing with Maudsley method and FBT. They also suggest that I get more scales and blind weigh D once a week to monitor progress. They also want me to work with their EDS nutritionist (who does not exist, I have been trying to get an appointment for 8 months!) This I am not happy about at all.

2. We went to GP on Monday too. D was with GP for a around 30 minutes, I went in after for a private chat. They do seem to get on well and at least D engages with her. In my chat the GP said not only am I dealing with an anorexic child, I am dealing with an extremely stroppy teenager and needs to figure some things out for herself. She suggests that D stay on 1200 calories for a couple months and up it from there, when D is ready to make that decision (she made the last one and accepted the additional snacks I was giving her). She set D a target and that was to go back to school in September and to think about what she needed to accomplish before that can happen.

3. I went to a private EDS nutritionist. We did not discuss calories or weight in the first session, she wants to get to the root and suggested that D have an 'adrenal stress profile' done, she is convinced that Ds adrenal levels are out of whack and her cortisol is too high and needs bringing down. She has recommended 10mg of DHEA (to help level out adrenal levels and improve anxiety and mood). Apparently this is why she is so anxious, stressed, depressed, volatile, angry etc........ she feels that if we can sort this out first, D will be more receptive to the magic plate, FBT, Maudsley etc... She also thinks D's body is too acidic and full of bad bacteria, based on all the that carbs she is eating, so this needs addressing too.

In the meantime -

I am trying magic plate, for weeks now to no avail AT ALL. What I have managed to do is get around 200 more calories into D a day with snacks. She was only eating 3 meals a day and feeling terrible in-between and it was only because she was so close to being readmitted into hospital that she eats the extra snacks. So this is certainly progress, but not enough. All food I make gets thrown away, does not matter how many batches and how long we sit at a table. She reverts to 'her' meal plans. (Pasta, pesto, cous cous, tofu, yogurt, porridge - all good stuff - but not enough -  if i add more it get thrown away) It's also hard to monitor, because I am not home 24/7, she is with my Mum 2 days a week whilst I work.

Based on all the advise above, I am at a loss for words. this is my professional team? I am very interested in what the nutritionist says, but really struggling with the suggestions.

In the meantime, my D is constantly nasty towards me (only me) barks orders and otherwise hurls verbal abuse at me. She has not forgiven me for throwing out the scales (everything is my fault since) and is even more body checking, disordered thinking and appears to be having auditory hallucinations (she had a bout of this pre anorexia and in the trenches of anxiety).  She is extremely anxious, if she doesn't poo at the same time every morning, the world ends... she is constantly saying she is 'done' and wants to die. Although I am very concerned about this, I think it's more of a cry for help. She is 100% unhappy that is for sure.

All I feel I can do is keep doing what I am doing and pushing it and then up the game end of May (where I have taken all of my holiday leave May - Sept), as I work in education, it's gets quiet over the summer so can work from home too.

Really stuck! I am shattered, but going to sleep pretty early every night which is lovely!

Re my health, I am getting a hip and lower back scan soon, will be good to see what's going on in there!

Kisses to you all brave warriors.

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D15, AN. 5' 8" and 46kg. Diagnosed and hospitalised in Sept 2017 for 9 days. At home since in recovery/relapse. In the trenches and tackling FBT.
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